dirty talk

I sometimes thought that I should have seen the first sign and run. The first sign was when I first came to thailand in 2007, on the first day of my trip in Bangkok, in a monastery, a monk flashed me, I think I wrote about that earlier in detail. At that time I was so blind of faith in Buddhism that I didn’t run away but short after became a nun, 8 precepts. The faith is still there but not the blindness.

Seeing my own mind defiled, seeing the danger in faults, I try to have compassion with those monastics who break their rules because they are overwhelmed by the defilements. Sometimes I might walk on a fine line and might be close to breaking a rule, sometimes thoughts of desire or anger can be hard to resist. Personally, I think it is very important to be honest with oneself.

When a monk loves a woman, I do not judge but wish them well from all my heart. But if he breaks his rule because of this love, or if he just plays, I am about to lose temper.

A friend in a rich country far away from Thailand had met a monk from a poor country (not Thailand). He obviously wanted to escape the poor life of a poor monk in a poor country. He uses internet, they exchanged email and skype addresses and soon after he left the rich country, my friend received the monks mails and chats where he talks about love, about how beautiful and sexy she is, how they could have a physical relationship (I describe here in abstract words what reads as what would be known as ‘dirty talk’ or so).

I know love, I know desire, the falling for it, and there is nothing wrong even with dirty talk, – as long one is not a monk. Do I need to say that I know these things from before becoming a nun, especially the falling for love…

I felt like vomiting and crying when she told me about it. She was desperate because she never had a relationship and likes him. Can’t monastics not just disrobe before they do such things? Or become Zen priests or something like that where marriage and a sexual relationship is allowed.

This is really so … – well, I don’t have words for it.

A later addition:

I feel the urge to add that there are many good monks out there, like my teacher, his teacher and the monk I have the honor to stay in the monastery with.



  1. Hi Ayya Phalanyani. I don’t disagree with you except there is one thing to consider which i would call the compassionate view. If the poor monk from a poor country has never had sex, he is at a considerable disadvantage to those of us in the west who at least have satisfied our curiosity before taking vows. Even the buddha had that advantage. This poor monk probably didn’t even choose to become a monk. It might have been decided for him. I think the strength of the temptation must be so much harder than for the likes of you and me given he’s a male and his probable youth and inexperience. (of course i’m guessing about that). And given the lack of education and worldliness, frankly nothing is surprising about his behaviour. Yes he may be falling short of his vows and buddhist training but it seems to me he’s behaving in a manner perfectly consistent with his background. He probably hasn’t had anyone to advise him about his alternatives and perhaps he doesn’t have any. Nevertheless, seeing this guy in the most negative light, given how he should be behaving, is probably the most common reaction.

    • Oh, maybe I didn’t write that clear enough, he had sex, It is my friend who hadn’t. We live of donations from other people, we have a responsability not to harm our sponsors or the Buddha’s teaching. Disrobe, then love, in that order it’s totally all right.

  2. Venerable bhikkuni,

    I completely understand where you are coming from. As a man and a lay person I may elaborate my point of view if any one finds it useful.

    What I feel is that all humans are vulnerable to desire and sensual pleasure in various degrees according to their kamma. If one dis obeys their precepts or bikku rules or which ever disciplinary violation they make the utmost damage that occurs is on them selves. However our compassion towards those who do shall not be limited. I my self struggles with very intense sexual urges which is frustrating and it spoils my meditation practice. As you may be aware, Ajahn Chah him self struggled heavily with his sexual desire at the early stage of his monk hood. Every one has a challenge wether it be greed, hatred or delusion. The one who is deluded who gives into their greed for sensual pleasure is lost looking for gratification in whatever they can find. I bet if every one was able give an option wether they want eternal sensual pleasure or eternal peace from this never ending itch, they would go for the latter.

    May all sentient beings be well and be free of suffering, may they attain Nibbana

  3. it is very common as I know a monk love a woman in everywhere. Ordinary monk will love a woman, this is natural. But Bhante is right that the monk should disrobe first. In HK, there are several cases like that. One case is a Thai monk from a Thai monastery. He has misconduct with a woman and the case went to Thai Sangharaja there. Finally that monk was forced to disrobe. Another one is a Malaysian monk. This monk is quite lucky, no one charges him. He is just forced to leave HK. Such a case in Mahayana is very common. Sometime , the case is monk and nun got the uncommon relationship. As a lay disciple, we just don’t get in touch with those monks and those Buddhist group, also tell our friend don’t contact those monk and group.
    kammassakomhi, one is the master of one’s kamma.

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